This time you have two videos to watch. The first one below is the song with lyrics, so you can hear the song and get its message. The second one is a powerful skit that was performed to the song. I'm not sure when or where it was performed, but it is amazing. I first saw it a while back and then just came across it again this past week. If you only have time to watch one of the videos, I highly recommend you watch the skit...it is much more powerful.
I know I said I was going to start doing Christmas songs after Thanksgiving, but I wanted to share this since I came across it and didn't want to pass the opportunity up. I hope it hits you as hard as the first time I saw it.
Sunday, November 30, 2008
Friday, November 28, 2008
Black Friday...Success!
I lived through another Black Friday. Last year, Traci did pretty much all of the BF shopping and this year it was me. Last night we sat down and planned out what we were going to get most of the people on our list and actually placed orders online at three different places, only paying shipping at one of them. (One of the things we ordered last night is my first iPod. This will make the train ride and walk to work much more enjoyable!)
I knew exactly where I would be going this morning and had a list of items to get at each place. I was able to purchase all the items on the list we made at each of the places. Here is how the timeline went.
3:45am - Arrive at JC Penney at Whittwood Town Center
4:00am - JC Penney doors open...I'm about the 15th person in line...let the madness begin.
4:15am - declare success #1 while leaving JC Penney and heading to Toys R Us in La Mirada.
4:30am - Arrive at Toys R Us and get in line which is around the side to the back.
5:00am - Toys R Us doors open
5:30am - get in line for cashier
6:00am - Declare success #2, despite now being behind schedule, and depart for Target back at Whittwood Town Center.
6:10am - Arrive at Target, which has now been open for 10 minutes.
7:00am - Declare hat trick success (#3) and leave Target to head for Big Lots to see if they by any chance have any more of the $5 TMX Cookies/Ernies left.
7:30am - Return home to silence as all are still asleep. I join them after being awake for 24 hours and get a three hour nap...a three hour nap. (It's funny if you say it like the Gilligan's Island theme song.)
So just one day into the shopping season and we have already completed shopping for a number of people on our list and spent half our Christmas budget. Seems like we're in good shape so far. This is the best we have done this early in shopping and I think it's because we sat down came up with a game plan. Something I'm sure we'll keep in mind for the future.
I knew exactly where I would be going this morning and had a list of items to get at each place. I was able to purchase all the items on the list we made at each of the places. Here is how the timeline went.
3:45am - Arrive at JC Penney at Whittwood Town Center
4:00am - JC Penney doors open...I'm about the 15th person in line...let the madness begin.
4:15am - declare success #1 while leaving JC Penney and heading to Toys R Us in La Mirada.
4:30am - Arrive at Toys R Us and get in line which is around the side to the back.
5:00am - Toys R Us doors open
5:30am - get in line for cashier
6:00am - Declare success #2, despite now being behind schedule, and depart for Target back at Whittwood Town Center.
6:10am - Arrive at Target, which has now been open for 10 minutes.
7:00am - Declare hat trick success (#3) and leave Target to head for Big Lots to see if they by any chance have any more of the $5 TMX Cookies/Ernies left.
7:30am - Return home to silence as all are still asleep. I join them after being awake for 24 hours and get a three hour nap...a three hour nap. (It's funny if you say it like the Gilligan's Island theme song.)
So just one day into the shopping season and we have already completed shopping for a number of people on our list and spent half our Christmas budget. Seems like we're in good shape so far. This is the best we have done this early in shopping and I think it's because we sat down came up with a game plan. Something I'm sure we'll keep in mind for the future.
Black Friday...The Game Plan
Here I am at 1:30 in the morning on Black Friday. I could have gotten ready for bed around midnight, but I figured with the game plan set for the best shopping day of the year and with our budget for Christmas tighter than it ever has been, we should take advantage of of what deals we can get to. So Traci just crawled into bed about half an hour ago and I decided, at this point, what is the point?! So I've played Wii, checked Facebook and My Space. Now I'm blogging and will then partake in a 15-round game of Mario Party before showering and heading out to JC Penney which opens at 4:00. After that I'll be off to Toys R Us which opens at 5:00 and then complete the morning madness by running over to Target which opens at 6:00. At that point I should be thoroughly exhausted, although I think I may already be there.
Will I be able to rest once I get home? Not likely. We are hosting a game night for our Sunday School class tonight at 5:00 (15 1/2 hours from now). This means there is cleaning to do. I also need to get out the Christmas decorations and do yard work, but I think I'll save that for Saturday since I should be in better shape then.
Ok off to Mario Party I go! Wish me luck (and sanity)!
Will I be able to rest once I get home? Not likely. We are hosting a game night for our Sunday School class tonight at 5:00 (15 1/2 hours from now). This means there is cleaning to do. I also need to get out the Christmas decorations and do yard work, but I think I'll save that for Saturday since I should be in better shape then.
Ok off to Mario Party I go! Wish me luck (and sanity)!
Wednesday, November 26, 2008
S2S - Brandon Heath "Give Me Your Eyes"
If you were in church a few weeks ago, you heard Bryan sing this song. It is a great song and, like the other I have posted before, has a great message about trying to see things through God's eyes, which is pretty much impossible for us humans. I hope you enjoy the song. By the way, this is the actual video for the song. Lyrics are below.
Lyrics | Brandon Heath lyrics - Give Me Your Eyes lyrics
Lyrics | Brandon Heath lyrics - Give Me Your Eyes lyrics
Sunday, November 23, 2008
S2S - Mercy Me "You Reign"
Here is the next installment on S2S. This is from Mercy Me, which has had many great songs. You've probably heard their biggest one "I Can Only Imagine." This one is called "You Reign" (this appears to be the official video...lyrics are scrolling separately below) and feels to be a song for me personally right now as I have been struggling with myself much more than normal lately. It's a good reminder that he is in control and that even though, often times things seem to be not what we want, He is still good to us.
Lyrics | Mercyme lyrics - You Reign lyrics
Lyrics | Mercyme lyrics - You Reign lyrics
Thursday, November 20, 2008
S2S in honor of Andrew - Mark Schultz "He's My Son"
There has been some sad news for many in our church this week. An 18-year old young man named Andrew passed away this past Monday night from cancer. He was diagnosed about 10 months ago from what I've read in a friend's blog. While I was not lucky enough to have known him personally, I can see what a great person he was through my friends at church who did know him. I thought this song would be appropriate to post in his honor despite the fact that I did not know him. Just in case you haven't heard this song, you may want to grab some tissues.
Wednesday, November 19, 2008
S2S - Third Day "Revelation"
Here is another great song from Third Day called "Revelation." The lyrics are below the song in case you want to know what they are I hope you enjoy.
- Third Day Lyrics
- Third Day Lyrics
Sunday, November 16, 2008
Our View of the Fires
Unless you've been in a coma, you have probably heard about the madness which is fire season that we're currently in here in southern California. (You know, the season that comes between summer and rain?) Well, while this is the closest we have ever been to any of these fires, we're still not close to being in danger. The closest fire is in Brea, which is two cities away, or about 7 - 8 miles. However, that is close enough to have a great view of the smoke going over us and to get a layer of ash everywhere. Needless to say, the kids have not played outside for a couple of days now. Courtney and I were fortunate enough to be able to go to the Daddy Day Luau at her preschool on Saturday before the Complex Fire blew up (so to speak). It was extremely windy, blowing stuff (signs, posters, crafts, etc.) all over the place and there was only a small smoke cloud off in the distance, much less than later as you'll see below. Anyway, here are a few pictures I took of the view we had of the fires, or actually the smoke and resulting ash. Hope you enjoy. Keep those affected by the fires in your prayers.
Looking east towards the origin of the fires.
This one and the next three are looking at the sun as it is obscured by the thick smoke. (None of them are using any zoom.)
These are pictures taken Saturday afternoon from our front yard in Whittier:
Looking southeast: the smoke following the flow of the Santa Ana winds to the west/southwest.
Looking east towards the origin of the fires.
This one and the next three are looking at the sun as it is obscured by the thick smoke. (None of them are using any zoom.)
The following pictures were taken this morning (Sunday):
The glowing sun about 7:00 this morning.
You can see some ash in the street.
The ash on our van.
And finally, the ash on my Jeep.
Friday, November 14, 2008
S2S - Tenth Avenue North "By Your Side"
Here is the second song of the S2S series. This is definitely one of my favorite songs right now. The first time I heard this song, I was caught up in it instantly. The music is great and the lyrics are powerful. I'm not sure what else to say so I'll let the song speak for itself.
Wednesday, November 12, 2008
My Third Concert
So tonight I was able to take in my third concert ever. (My first was seeing our friend Sol's band, Greenleaf Avenue at Universal City Walk a few years ago, and my second one was seeing our church's band, the WACC Band, play at a local park.) Tonight, we saw the Robbie Seay Band play at our church and it was great. We were able to sit up in the third row so it was cool to be so close. There's just something about live, loud music that gets me going, especially when it's music with a message!
I gained a new appreciation of musicians tonight in a couple of ways. Laura Knaak and her band opened with about 5 songs. She's the assistant music pastor at our church so we get to hear her almost every week, and she has an amazing voice. It was her drum player that impressed me (and Traci) the most on one of the songs. Playing the drums alone takes plenty of coordination. However, this guy was also able to do a solo (singing) while playing the drums. Granted, I have minimal, if any, musical ability, but that still was very impressive.
It was the electric guitar player of Robbie Seay's band that took the cake in my opinion. He had a control board for his guitar that had at least three sections to it from what I could tell. Each part made the guitar sound different and he would be changing the sounds multiple times every song. (And he looked like he was about 16!)
Also, Robbie's brother, Chris, did a couple of couple of mini-sermons in between sets and he was pretty funny.
After the concert ended, we were able to chat with Robbie Seay for a few minutes and have my mom take a picture of us with him. Considering how much I love music (especially when it's live), I need to try to go to more concerts. If only they weren't so darn expensive usually. Fortunately, tonight only set us back $14 total! We got more than our money's worth. Enjoy some pictures from the concert below.
I gained a new appreciation of musicians tonight in a couple of ways. Laura Knaak and her band opened with about 5 songs. She's the assistant music pastor at our church so we get to hear her almost every week, and she has an amazing voice. It was her drum player that impressed me (and Traci) the most on one of the songs. Playing the drums alone takes plenty of coordination. However, this guy was also able to do a solo (singing) while playing the drums. Granted, I have minimal, if any, musical ability, but that still was very impressive.
It was the electric guitar player of Robbie Seay's band that took the cake in my opinion. He had a control board for his guitar that had at least three sections to it from what I could tell. Each part made the guitar sound different and he would be changing the sounds multiple times every song. (And he looked like he was about 16!)
Also, Robbie's brother, Chris, did a couple of couple of mini-sermons in between sets and he was pretty funny.
After the concert ended, we were able to chat with Robbie Seay for a few minutes and have my mom take a picture of us with him. Considering how much I love music (especially when it's live), I need to try to go to more concerts. If only they weren't so darn expensive usually. Fortunately, tonight only set us back $14 total! We got more than our money's worth. Enjoy some pictures from the concert below.
Robbie Seay
The drummer
The amazing electric guitarist
The bass guitarist
Traci and I with Robbie Seay after the concert.
Monday, November 10, 2008
A New Blog Feature: S2S (Songs To Share) - Robbie Seay Band "Song of Hope"
I'm excited to start something new here on my humble little blog. It comes from something I did earlier this year with a group from my church for spiritual formation. I would weekly share a song via link in an e-mail where they could then listen to the song and hopefully get something out of it.
Now I'm trying to open it up to a bigger audience and maybe even turn it into a ministry of sorts. This is why I have enabled a new feature on my blog where you can e-mail the posting to any of your friends and others. I'm also looking for feedback which you can do by e-mailing me or posting a comment on my blog. I have to approve comments before they are posted on the blog so if you respond that way and don't want me to post it, just let me know and I'll keep it off the site.
What I'll be doing is posting videos of songs that I think have a powerful message. Some of the videos will be official videos and others will be more along the lines of what we do in our church during worship where there are pictures or videos playing behind the words. The words are my main focus on the songs I post here as they are what convey the message of the music.
I've already got 5 songs I'm ready to share and I'm not going to limit it to one per week. So, on with the first song...
I have chosen "Song of Hope" by Robbie Seay Band to be the first song partly because I will be attending the concert they are doing at our church on Wednesday night. I never go to concerts so I'm excited about this being at a place that is familiar to me and that I love going to. This song is also very appropriate with all that is going on in the world right now with the economic issues worldwide and a new president about to come into office who has been associated with bringing hope with him. We can all use some hope during the tough times and there are plenty of tough time to go around right now. I hope you enjoy this song (it is not the official video, but rather along the lines of having pictures behind the words).
Now I'm trying to open it up to a bigger audience and maybe even turn it into a ministry of sorts. This is why I have enabled a new feature on my blog where you can e-mail the posting to any of your friends and others. I'm also looking for feedback which you can do by e-mailing me or posting a comment on my blog. I have to approve comments before they are posted on the blog so if you respond that way and don't want me to post it, just let me know and I'll keep it off the site.
What I'll be doing is posting videos of songs that I think have a powerful message. Some of the videos will be official videos and others will be more along the lines of what we do in our church during worship where there are pictures or videos playing behind the words. The words are my main focus on the songs I post here as they are what convey the message of the music.
I've already got 5 songs I'm ready to share and I'm not going to limit it to one per week. So, on with the first song...
I have chosen "Song of Hope" by Robbie Seay Band to be the first song partly because I will be attending the concert they are doing at our church on Wednesday night. I never go to concerts so I'm excited about this being at a place that is familiar to me and that I love going to. This song is also very appropriate with all that is going on in the world right now with the economic issues worldwide and a new president about to come into office who has been associated with bringing hope with him. We can all use some hope during the tough times and there are plenty of tough time to go around right now. I hope you enjoy this song (it is not the official video, but rather along the lines of having pictures behind the words).
Sunday, November 9, 2008
Coming Soon...
Just wanted to give you a heads up that I will be starting something kind of new. I will be posting videos to songs that I have found to have powerful messages. I am soliciting feedback as to whether I should just post them on this blog or create a second blog that would be focused solely on the messages through music. If you have an opinion on whether or not it should be here or a separate blog, let me know. I plan on posting the first video tomorrow (hopefully).
This actually isn't entirely new. I shared music with a spiritual formation group I was a part of earlier this year because I love music, and a lot of music can have a really powerful message if you take the time to listen.
This actually isn't entirely new. I shared music with a spiritual formation group I was a part of earlier this year because I love music, and a lot of music can have a really powerful message if you take the time to listen.
Saturday, November 8, 2008
What the...
If any of you have sent me forwarded e-mails of various kinds, there's a decent chance you have received a response from me to the effect of "check out snopes.com and you'll see it's not true." Well, being the skeptical person that I am, I have fun perusing snopes just for fun. And holy crap did I find something that even freaks me out.
Now I need to tell you that it's hard to tell whether or not this is real. Looking at the picture, I think it's fake. Reading the article, I think it's real. The fact that a second instance of this was also documented (there is a link is in the article above, or you can see it here, and this picture looks more real) makes me think it's real. So that's 2-1 in favor of real. I'll let you be the judge. Snopes.com does say this is in the area (Daily Snopes) where I found it: "Stories are chosen for inclusion here purely on the basis of their appeal to our readers; we make no claims about the reliability of information linked from this page." However, I'll leave you with this thought under the assumption that it is true...thank goodness we don't live in Australia!!!!!!!
Now I need to tell you that it's hard to tell whether or not this is real. Looking at the picture, I think it's fake. Reading the article, I think it's real. The fact that a second instance of this was also documented (there is a link is in the article above, or you can see it here, and this picture looks more real) makes me think it's real. So that's 2-1 in favor of real. I'll let you be the judge. Snopes.com does say this is in the area (Daily Snopes) where I found it: "Stories are chosen for inclusion here purely on the basis of their appeal to our readers; we make no claims about the reliability of information linked from this page." However, I'll leave you with this thought under the assumption that it is true...thank goodness we don't live in Australia!!!!!!!
Wednesday, November 5, 2008
My Election Day Debate
If you know me very well, you know I almost never talk about politics. I do of course have my opinions, which is one of the reasons I started this blog. Yesterday a friend of ours sent out an e-mail urging us to vote against Proposition 8 and well, the rest is what you read below. (Please keep in mind I am not posting every e-mail in the exchange, but am posting many. Since I was at work and didn't want my opinions to run the risk of being passed off as my company's view, I was having Traci forward them for me, except for the last one which I sent from home after voting last night.) I don't think I usually ask for feedback on blogs, but this a definite exception. Please let me know what you think about this discussion, and more specifically, my arguments/defense. Am I off base? Is my argument weak? Am I wrong or a bad human being for thinking the way I do? I like to think not, but am very interested in what you think. Please be honest, whether it's for or against me. Hopefully you can follow the flow of what was said. Be warned, this is an extremely long post!
Original e-mail from Alli:
Dear friends and family,
While my academic background previous to this year focused primarily on Asian history, this past semester I have enjoyed my first opportunity to teach American history. It has been both an honor and an eye-opening experience. In learning more about US history in the course of preparing to teach it, I have gained a deeper appreciation for the values of liberty and freedom our country was founded upon.
Tonight I am writing to share some of the things I have learned and urge you to vote to uphold American values. I am of the opinion that Proposition 8 is distinctly un-American and I would like to explain why I think so based on the history of our great country.
People often toss around notions of the Constitution and the values of our Founding Fathers. It is important to recall what those Fathers actually believed and fought for because I think that State Propositions in general are a potential threat to those values. Many Americans seem to think that this country is fundamentally a democracy. It is not. We are a republic based on indirect democracy. Why? What the Founding Fathers most feared was the "tyranny" of majority rule. They were very concerned about the ability of the majority to restrict the liberties of the minority, in other words, themselves. (They were elite members of an economic minority.) They realized that given direct popular vote on legislation, it would be all too easy for majority rule to reduce or restrict the freedoms of others. This is why they created a system in which we vote not directly for laws, but for representatives who will create legislation. They also created a system of checks and balances which gave the judicial branch oversight on protecting the constitution and individual liberties from the tyranny of the majority. In other words, when judges strike down laws which restrict the rights of a small group, even when that is what the majority has voted on, they are doing their job as foreseen by the Founding Fathers in upholding the American political system. Imagine the precedent that could be set by a new system of majority rule in California. Imagine how this could potentially effect the restriction of other types of liberties, such as religious expression, or freedom of association. Majority rule would mean that the liberties of smaller groups of voters could be restricted and this could potentially effect your liberties too. Our country is most definitely not based on the idea that the personal beliefs of the majority should be reflected in new legislation. This is a dangerous notion indeed.
Liberties have often been endangered throughout US history and for this reason we must be vigilant in upholding freedom and equality even when it doesn't conform to our own personal beliefs and moral standards. For example, though freedom of speech has been on the Bill of Rights since our country's inception, this right has been totally unprotected for much of our history. Up until the early 1900s there was little to no recognition of this basic freedom. In most cities in California during this period, citizens would have to approve any speeches they wished to make in public with the local mayor. This is just one example of a freedom we tend to take for granted as part of the basis of our country, without recognizing the constant struggle entailed in protecting such freedoms. Civil liberties of others have often been restricted by the beliefs of the majority only to be struck down by Superior Court judges whose duty compels them to protect all citizens equally rather than allow the tyranny of the majority.
Today it is the 14th Amendment to the US constitution that is imperiled by attempts at legislation like Prop 8. The 14th Amendment specifically requires states to provide equal protections of civil liberties under the law to all citizens of the United States. The year 1948 saw a case on marriage in which the judge ruled against the constitutionality of another law supported by the majority of the California voting population: Section 69 of the California Civil Code stated that marriage between different races was not recognized by the state. This landmark case, "Perez v. Sharp" began the process of overturning marriage restrictions on the basis of race. The court held that marriage is a fundamental right of citizens of the United States and that laws restricting that right must not be based solely on personal belief. "Marriage is thus something more than a civil contract subject to regulation by the state; it is a fundamental right of free men." (Perez v. Sharp 32 Cal.2d 711, 714-715)
"Eliminating rights," the title of Proposition 8, is simply un-American. I urge you to vote not on what you believe to be right or wrong regarding marriage or sexual morality, but to uphold the basis of our nation: the equal protection of personal, civil liberties under the law and the same freedoms for all citizens. This is nothing short of what Americans have been fighting for since the birth of our country.
My response:
She has a good, very educated stance, but I would not feel right voting no on 8. I know that faith played a big role in the lives of our country's founding fathers and played a role in the formation of our country. Thus the words "In God We Trust" on all pieces of money. If we trust God but vote for something that contradicts His word, we are hypocrites. That's my 2-cent rebuttal.
Since I follow God and try to make Him the center of my life and actions, I cannot in good conscience vote to recognize gay marriage when that is not an acceptable lifestyle to God.
Josh's (I don't know who he is) response:
I'm sure that when blacks were asking for equal rights, people also cited faith as a reason to withhold them. Sure, many blacks at the turn of the century were not christians, so I guess they didn't deserve equal rights. By that account, perhaps white jews didn't deserve them either.
There is a reason why the founding fathers, all of whom were very religious, put into the constitution a separation of church and state. Keep religion where it belongs, out of politics. Every man, woman, and child in this country deserves, nay, demands equal rights and recognition under the law. There is no difference between this discrimination and any other. If you insist that you must vote yes on something like proposition 8, then you should also happily accept the label of Bigot.
Religious doctrine has been changed and manipulated over time. You can not deny this, as none of you have been stoned to death for dishonoring your parents, nor have you gone around stoning others. If you have no beard, then you are breaking religious doctrine. Don't use something so antiquated to try and make yourself look like less of a bigot. If you are going to vote yes on Proposition 8, then just admit that you have a problem accepting your other humans for what they are. I have a funny feeling you would feel differently if someone else was in charge (by someone else, I mean not white and christian) and you were suddently wanting more rights.
My response ("my husband") and Traci's ("me") response:
This is from my husband:
No kidding. And we wonder why our country is in the shape it is in? He makes it sounds like I can't accept gays or may even be a homophobe. He also makes me sounds like a racist. I'm not saying I'm the most educated person, but perhaps he should get to know someone before making personal attacks. I gave my opinion on something and expect others to have their own opinion. That's what this country is about and why we vote in the first place. Debates are fine and healthy, disrespect is not.
To directly go against one of his points, I can accept people for who they are. I may not agree with choices they make, but that is a huge difference from not accepting them. I have friends that do things I don't agree with, but I accept them as they are. For example, Matt responded to my comments and we don't agree with each other, but we respect each other. It just bothers me that someone I don't know would personally attack me without knowing me. If someone wants to hate me after getting to know me, fine. Hating me (and especially degrading me) without knowing me, that's where I have the problem.
This is from me:
You just made my own case for me. I am tollerant of their opinions, lifestyles, and identities. This just shows how little you know of me. I am tollerant of it, but that doesn't mean that I have to like it or agree with it. Of course we should accept people as they are and the lifestyle they chose to lead.
If this prop doesn't pass than those churches you speak of will hear about it. There will be problems when gays show up at their doors and they refuse to marry them. So it does/will become a "civil rights" issue. After all, they are claiming that marriage is a fundamental right. So, if it is a fundamental right, then those churches who do not agree with or believe in it will surely see the outcomes of this. Don't try to pretend it won't happen just because you don't have a problem with any specific church or person not allowing it.
And regarding the New Testament. Seriously, maybe you should read it. Because he says that we are to do away with the old laws. Like abbiding by the Sabbath and all of those rules. Galations chapter 2 and 3 has a lot to say about this. If you do not have a bible, I would be glad to quote it all for you.
Josh's response:
To your husband:
I am not here to insult you. Nor am I here to insult your wife. But I am here to call a spade a spade. If you vote yes on a proposition that limits one groups rights simply because you can not agree with their lifestyle, then you are not very tolerant of them. That is not an insult, but a fact. Tolerance (and justice for that matter) implies that you are blind to their life choices, as long as they are not infringing on your personal rights. You have the right to despise homosexuality and gay marriage, and you have the right to speak out about it, and I would never dream of taking away your rights because I think that would be bad for society.
I respect you and your wife as people, even though I disagree with your politics. I have married into a family where many of the family members have different political views than I do, and yet I love all of them without question and respect their right to have an opinion. I don't hate nor do I degrade you, but I think you should realize that your stance is a stance of bigotry.
To your wife:
If, as you say, you are tolerant of other people, then why not allow them the right to marry? Why would you take that away from them? Do you really think that gay men and women will want to get married in churches where they are not welcome, or that they will start showing up randomly at your doors asking for nuptials? If you are truly tolerant, as you claim, then you would tolerate their desires to get married and let them do their thing while you do your. A vote for Proposition 8 is a vote against tolerance.
I appreciate your offer to read me the new testament. I have read it before, and it is a wonderful text. I'm sure you are more knowledgeable about it than I am, so I will trust that you have the readings correct.
And, finally, I would hope that, if I was being a bigot, that someone would stand up to me and call me one. It is important that we not stand by when we feel that anyone is infringing upon anothers rights. So, if you feel offended by the fact that I am calling intolerance bigotry, that is your right. But I will not apologize for standing up for those who are underrepresented and for calling out those who wish to take away their rights.
My response:
Well, Josh, one last comment from me for the night. The bottom line here is that we have two differing opinions, partly based on two different definitions of the word tolerance, and that we are going to have to agree to disagree. Here is the definition I have been presented with: Tolerance (and justice for that matter) implies that you are blind to their life choices, as long as they are not infringing on your personal rights. My definition of tolerance is acknowledging and accepting differences. Tolerating does not mean I have to agree. I can disagree with something or someone and still tolerate it or them. To me, being blind to something qualifies as being ignorant. (And don't even try to convince me that tolerance = justice.) If Prop 8 fails, which it appears it will based on pre-election polls, then I will be tolerant of gay marriage. I still won't agree with it, but I will tolerate it. Also, I don't despise homosexuality or gay marriage, I just don't agree with it. Again, difference between despise and not agreeing with something.
Also, passing off opinions as fact is probably not the right approach in a debate, as it undermines the whole argument. You can call me a bigot, that's fine, but it's not a fact which you make it come across as. It's your opinion based on your definitions as I discussed above. There is a huge difference between fact and opinion. You can say you didn't degrade me, but you did. What you said about me was offensive, mainly because you have no idea who I am outside of today's expressed opinions, and that's how I feel. (I wonder if we have different opinions on definitions or interpretations on the word degrade as well.)
At this point I'm really just poking holes in your argument from my point of view. You're not going to change my point of view and I'm not going to change yours. I have no problem with that. I placed my vote and I hope you placed yours. I rarely get involved with political debates, but it has been interesting to do this today. At least we live in a country where we can have these discussion and vote to express our opinions.
And Matt, thanks for sticking up for me. You know who we really are and I know that despite our differing opinions, we can still hang out, respect each other and have fun. You also made a good point about making implications about polygamy and pedophilia as a result of Prop 8 passing. I also thought that was a weak argument for Prop 8, despite supporting the same point of view. It just goes to show you that even people with similar views and supporting the same things can have different thoughts and opinions.
Until next election,
Scott
Original e-mail from Alli:
Dear friends and family,
While my academic background previous to this year focused primarily on Asian history, this past semester I have enjoyed my first opportunity to teach American history. It has been both an honor and an eye-opening experience. In learning more about US history in the course of preparing to teach it, I have gained a deeper appreciation for the values of liberty and freedom our country was founded upon.
Tonight I am writing to share some of the things I have learned and urge you to vote to uphold American values. I am of the opinion that Proposition 8 is distinctly un-American and I would like to explain why I think so based on the history of our great country.
People often toss around notions of the Constitution and the values of our Founding Fathers. It is important to recall what those Fathers actually believed and fought for because I think that State Propositions in general are a potential threat to those values. Many Americans seem to think that this country is fundamentally a democracy. It is not. We are a republic based on indirect democracy. Why? What the Founding Fathers most feared was the "tyranny" of majority rule. They were very concerned about the ability of the majority to restrict the liberties of the minority, in other words, themselves. (They were elite members of an economic minority.) They realized that given direct popular vote on legislation, it would be all too easy for majority rule to reduce or restrict the freedoms of others. This is why they created a system in which we vote not directly for laws, but for representatives who will create legislation. They also created a system of checks and balances which gave the judicial branch oversight on protecting the constitution and individual liberties from the tyranny of the majority. In other words, when judges strike down laws which restrict the rights of a small group, even when that is what the majority has voted on, they are doing their job as foreseen by the Founding Fathers in upholding the American political system. Imagine the precedent that could be set by a new system of majority rule in California. Imagine how this could potentially effect the restriction of other types of liberties, such as religious expression, or freedom of association. Majority rule would mean that the liberties of smaller groups of voters could be restricted and this could potentially effect your liberties too. Our country is most definitely not based on the idea that the personal beliefs of the majority should be reflected in new legislation. This is a dangerous notion indeed.
Liberties have often been endangered throughout US history and for this reason we must be vigilant in upholding freedom and equality even when it doesn't conform to our own personal beliefs and moral standards. For example, though freedom of speech has been on the Bill of Rights since our country's inception, this right has been totally unprotected for much of our history. Up until the early 1900s there was little to no recognition of this basic freedom. In most cities in California during this period, citizens would have to approve any speeches they wished to make in public with the local mayor. This is just one example of a freedom we tend to take for granted as part of the basis of our country, without recognizing the constant struggle entailed in protecting such freedoms. Civil liberties of others have often been restricted by the beliefs of the majority only to be struck down by Superior Court judges whose duty compels them to protect all citizens equally rather than allow the tyranny of the majority.
Today it is the 14th Amendment to the US constitution that is imperiled by attempts at legislation like Prop 8. The 14th Amendment specifically requires states to provide equal protections of civil liberties under the law to all citizens of the United States. The year 1948 saw a case on marriage in which the judge ruled against the constitutionality of another law supported by the majority of the California voting population: Section 69 of the California Civil Code stated that marriage between different races was not recognized by the state. This landmark case, "Perez v. Sharp" began the process of overturning marriage restrictions on the basis of race. The court held that marriage is a fundamental right of citizens of the United States and that laws restricting that right must not be based solely on personal belief. "Marriage is thus something more than a civil contract subject to regulation by the state; it is a fundamental right of free men." (Perez v. Sharp 32 Cal.2d 711, 714-715)
"Eliminating rights," the title of Proposition 8, is simply un-American. I urge you to vote not on what you believe to be right or wrong regarding marriage or sexual morality, but to uphold the basis of our nation: the equal protection of personal, civil liberties under the law and the same freedoms for all citizens. This is nothing short of what Americans have been fighting for since the birth of our country.
My response:
She has a good, very educated stance, but I would not feel right voting no on 8. I know that faith played a big role in the lives of our country's founding fathers and played a role in the formation of our country. Thus the words "In God We Trust" on all pieces of money. If we trust God but vote for something that contradicts His word, we are hypocrites. That's my 2-cent rebuttal.
Since I follow God and try to make Him the center of my life and actions, I cannot in good conscience vote to recognize gay marriage when that is not an acceptable lifestyle to God.
Josh's (I don't know who he is) response:
I'm sure that when blacks were asking for equal rights, people also cited faith as a reason to withhold them. Sure, many blacks at the turn of the century were not christians, so I guess they didn't deserve equal rights. By that account, perhaps white jews didn't deserve them either.
There is a reason why the founding fathers, all of whom were very religious, put into the constitution a separation of church and state. Keep religion where it belongs, out of politics. Every man, woman, and child in this country deserves, nay, demands equal rights and recognition under the law. There is no difference between this discrimination and any other. If you insist that you must vote yes on something like proposition 8, then you should also happily accept the label of Bigot.
Religious doctrine has been changed and manipulated over time. You can not deny this, as none of you have been stoned to death for dishonoring your parents, nor have you gone around stoning others. If you have no beard, then you are breaking religious doctrine. Don't use something so antiquated to try and make yourself look like less of a bigot. If you are going to vote yes on Proposition 8, then just admit that you have a problem accepting your other humans for what they are. I have a funny feeling you would feel differently if someone else was in charge (by someone else, I mean not white and christian) and you were suddently wanting more rights.
My response ("my husband") and Traci's ("me") response:
This is from my husband:
No kidding. And we wonder why our country is in the shape it is in? He makes it sounds like I can't accept gays or may even be a homophobe. He also makes me sounds like a racist. I'm not saying I'm the most educated person, but perhaps he should get to know someone before making personal attacks. I gave my opinion on something and expect others to have their own opinion. That's what this country is about and why we vote in the first place. Debates are fine and healthy, disrespect is not.
To directly go against one of his points, I can accept people for who they are. I may not agree with choices they make, but that is a huge difference from not accepting them. I have friends that do things I don't agree with, but I accept them as they are. For example, Matt responded to my comments and we don't agree with each other, but we respect each other. It just bothers me that someone I don't know would personally attack me without knowing me. If someone wants to hate me after getting to know me, fine. Hating me (and especially degrading me) without knowing me, that's where I have the problem.
This is from me:
You just made my own case for me. I am tollerant of their opinions, lifestyles, and identities. This just shows how little you know of me. I am tollerant of it, but that doesn't mean that I have to like it or agree with it. Of course we should accept people as they are and the lifestyle they chose to lead.
If this prop doesn't pass than those churches you speak of will hear about it. There will be problems when gays show up at their doors and they refuse to marry them. So it does/will become a "civil rights" issue. After all, they are claiming that marriage is a fundamental right. So, if it is a fundamental right, then those churches who do not agree with or believe in it will surely see the outcomes of this. Don't try to pretend it won't happen just because you don't have a problem with any specific church or person not allowing it.
And regarding the New Testament. Seriously, maybe you should read it. Because he says that we are to do away with the old laws. Like abbiding by the Sabbath and all of those rules. Galations chapter 2 and 3 has a lot to say about this. If you do not have a bible, I would be glad to quote it all for you.
Josh's response:
To your husband:
I am not here to insult you. Nor am I here to insult your wife. But I am here to call a spade a spade. If you vote yes on a proposition that limits one groups rights simply because you can not agree with their lifestyle, then you are not very tolerant of them. That is not an insult, but a fact. Tolerance (and justice for that matter) implies that you are blind to their life choices, as long as they are not infringing on your personal rights. You have the right to despise homosexuality and gay marriage, and you have the right to speak out about it, and I would never dream of taking away your rights because I think that would be bad for society.
I respect you and your wife as people, even though I disagree with your politics. I have married into a family where many of the family members have different political views than I do, and yet I love all of them without question and respect their right to have an opinion. I don't hate nor do I degrade you, but I think you should realize that your stance is a stance of bigotry.
To your wife:
If, as you say, you are tolerant of other people, then why not allow them the right to marry? Why would you take that away from them? Do you really think that gay men and women will want to get married in churches where they are not welcome, or that they will start showing up randomly at your doors asking for nuptials? If you are truly tolerant, as you claim, then you would tolerate their desires to get married and let them do their thing while you do your. A vote for Proposition 8 is a vote against tolerance.
I appreciate your offer to read me the new testament. I have read it before, and it is a wonderful text. I'm sure you are more knowledgeable about it than I am, so I will trust that you have the readings correct.
And, finally, I would hope that, if I was being a bigot, that someone would stand up to me and call me one. It is important that we not stand by when we feel that anyone is infringing upon anothers rights. So, if you feel offended by the fact that I am calling intolerance bigotry, that is your right. But I will not apologize for standing up for those who are underrepresented and for calling out those who wish to take away their rights.
My response:
Well, Josh, one last comment from me for the night. The bottom line here is that we have two differing opinions, partly based on two different definitions of the word tolerance, and that we are going to have to agree to disagree. Here is the definition I have been presented with: Tolerance (and justice for that matter) implies that you are blind to their life choices, as long as they are not infringing on your personal rights. My definition of tolerance is acknowledging and accepting differences. Tolerating does not mean I have to agree. I can disagree with something or someone and still tolerate it or them. To me, being blind to something qualifies as being ignorant. (And don't even try to convince me that tolerance = justice.) If Prop 8 fails, which it appears it will based on pre-election polls, then I will be tolerant of gay marriage. I still won't agree with it, but I will tolerate it. Also, I don't despise homosexuality or gay marriage, I just don't agree with it. Again, difference between despise and not agreeing with something.
Also, passing off opinions as fact is probably not the right approach in a debate, as it undermines the whole argument. You can call me a bigot, that's fine, but it's not a fact which you make it come across as. It's your opinion based on your definitions as I discussed above. There is a huge difference between fact and opinion. You can say you didn't degrade me, but you did. What you said about me was offensive, mainly because you have no idea who I am outside of today's expressed opinions, and that's how I feel. (I wonder if we have different opinions on definitions or interpretations on the word degrade as well.)
At this point I'm really just poking holes in your argument from my point of view. You're not going to change my point of view and I'm not going to change yours. I have no problem with that. I placed my vote and I hope you placed yours. I rarely get involved with political debates, but it has been interesting to do this today. At least we live in a country where we can have these discussion and vote to express our opinions.
And Matt, thanks for sticking up for me. You know who we really are and I know that despite our differing opinions, we can still hang out, respect each other and have fun. You also made a good point about making implications about polygamy and pedophilia as a result of Prop 8 passing. I also thought that was a weak argument for Prop 8, despite supporting the same point of view. It just goes to show you that even people with similar views and supporting the same things can have different thoughts and opinions.
Until next election,
Scott
Sunday, November 2, 2008
Car Accident, All OK
We had a scary moment yesterday after we left for Courtney's audition. We were on Lambert and had just gotten through the intersection at Colima. All of a sudden the car in front of us is stopping so we hit the brakes hard. (Keep in mind, we had a 15 minute downpour about 15 minutes before this. Also, it turns out everybody was stopping because there was a cop with sirens on heading the other way, east, on Colima.) Fortunately, we stopped before hitting the car in the front of us. Once we stopped, I looked in the rear view mirror (as I have made a habit whenever I stop hard) and saw the car behind us rapidly approaching. It looked like it lunged forward, like when you hit the brakes hard, but it wound up hitting us.
When we pulled over to talk he said he hit the brakes, but just slid after that. It was pretty amazing to see that there was really no damage to either car. He lost some paint from his bumper and bent his license plate frame a little, but that's all on his car. As for our car, just a couple of indents in the bumper from the screws of his license plate, and some of his paint had stuck but it wiped off with a light touch. Pretty amazing to us because the impact sounded like there should have been some visible damage.
In terms of injuries, there doesn't appear to be anything too serious. I'm fine, Courtney and Skyler are fine, but Traci is at the doctor's office right now since her neck is a little sore and stiff. I just hope her injury isn't too serious and that this doesn't get too complicated with insurance, but at least we have it.
I haven't read Traci's entry on her blog about this, but I'm sure she went into much more detail. (That's one of the big differences between us when retelling stories/experiences.) I'll provide an update when I have one.
When we pulled over to talk he said he hit the brakes, but just slid after that. It was pretty amazing to see that there was really no damage to either car. He lost some paint from his bumper and bent his license plate frame a little, but that's all on his car. As for our car, just a couple of indents in the bumper from the screws of his license plate, and some of his paint had stuck but it wiped off with a light touch. Pretty amazing to us because the impact sounded like there should have been some visible damage.
In terms of injuries, there doesn't appear to be anything too serious. I'm fine, Courtney and Skyler are fine, but Traci is at the doctor's office right now since her neck is a little sore and stiff. I just hope her injury isn't too serious and that this doesn't get too complicated with insurance, but at least we have it.
I haven't read Traci's entry on her blog about this, but I'm sure she went into much more detail. (That's one of the big differences between us when retelling stories/experiences.) I'll provide an update when I have one.
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